ALL boat building is illegal without a MARINA license ...

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Postby Skywoolf » Sat Jan 31, 2009 9:51 am

Thanks for the tip. My wife is also a Filipina expat and she works in Hong Kong. We were both living in Manila when my visa was processed about 7 years ago and Manila is probably the worst place in the Philippines to do things like this. Previous to that I was on a expat working visa for about 8 years. I am now based in Davao where the corruption and inefficiency, etc is nowhere near as bad as Manila.
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Postby bangkaboat » Sun May 24, 2009 5:33 am

Fascinating thread, people!

I built a couple of large fishing boats, near General Santos, in the early 1990s. At that time, I had to go through an inspection/titling process with the local coast guard office. In the end, it cost me P$1,000 per boat, no big deal.

As there is at least one builder I know of who is building boats at the subic zone - for offshore sales - I would think that this is the reasoning behind the licensing requirement?

When I return to Davao, to build on Samal, I will check this out, though most of my "butt-kissing" will be to the local authorities & coast guard. I would expect that this law would be enforced more with foreigners than citizens. From my perspective this is pretty simple; if I have to jump through too many hoops & pay out too much money, I'll open the operation in Panama, instead. If it is a requirement for me to spend 4,400 pesos, why wouldn't I? It has been my experience, that the Philippine embassies abroad are the best place to sort out these types of issues, prior to investing. I learned this the hard way.

Conversely, I don't think that the authorities would bother with some guy building a little daysailer in his carport. That is the beauty of the Philippine authorities. In Canada, "no" means "no", the reasoning being irrelevant. In The Philippines, things can be "worked out". I like that, a lot!

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Postby Sqworks » Sat May 30, 2009 4:26 pm

Bangka boat,

huh ????? !!!!! ??? what law ??
There ain't no law, against me building a boat !

Marina what ? who that ?

SPEED RULES !

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Postby Skywoolf » Thu Jun 04, 2009 3:48 pm

I just received this from a freind:

In the area of shipbuilding, I believe MARINA has no legal jurisdiction over you if you are simply boatbuilding as a hobby and not for profit. MARINA's Memorandum Circular enforcing licensing for all shipbuilders can be challenged for overstepping the authority granted under PD 474:

http://www.lawphil.net/statutes/presdec ... _1974.html

a. "Maritime Industry", briefly referred to as "industry" in the broadest concept of the term. All enterprises engaged in the business of designing, constructing, manufacturing, acquiring, operating, supplying, repairing and/or maintaining vessels, or component parts thereof; of managing and/or operating shipping lines, stevedoring arrastre and customs brokerage services, shipyards, drydocks, marine railways, marine repair shops, shipping and freight forwarding agencies and similar enterprises.

Section 4. Maritime Industry Authority, Creation and Organization. There is hereby created a Maritime Industry Authority, hereinafter referred to as the "Authority", under the Office of the President. It shall be composed of a governing board of directors to be known as Maritime Industry Board and the Management.
The Authority shall have general jurisdiction and control over all persons, corporations, firms or entities in the maritime industry of the Philippines and shall supervise, regulate in accordance with this Decree.

Clearly, MARINA only has jurisdiction over an enterprise or person engaged in the business of shipbuilding.
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Postby Skywoolf » Thu Jun 04, 2009 3:50 pm

And this:

http://www.marina.gov.ph/policies/mc/mc095.html

2.1 Coverage – No shipyard, graving dock, floating dock, liftdock, marine railway, marine repair shop, shipbreaking yard/facilities and no person or enterprise shall engage in the construction and/or repair/shipbreaking of any watercraft or any phase or part thereof without a valid license from the Maritime Industry Authority.
2.3 Qualification requirements – For any foregoing categories, the applicant must meet the following: 2.3.1 General Requirements:
(a) The applicant must be a Filipino citizen or a corporation/ partnership at least 60% of the authorized stock of which is owned by Filipino citizens except for joint ventures which are registered with the Securities and Exchange Commission, the board of Investments and/or Export Processing Zone Authorities.


This might be another case where an agency is currently exceeding the authority granted to it under law. The law creating MARINA (P.D. 474) does not give it any specific authority to license shipbuilding, but that's exactly what MARINA did in 1994 by way of nothing more than a Memorandum Circular. In comparison, the licensing of motorists is authorized under a law passed by Congress (i.e., RA 4316). It's no wonder shipbuilding is stagnant in this country.
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Postby lncc » Thu Jun 04, 2009 4:29 pm

Nice post skywolf. I think you could be on to something but I'm no lawyer. Why all the effort?

Anyway, my thinking is ... and maybe its MARINA's too ... P4k is nothing compared to what you'd spend in lawyers fees. But here's a tip ... get yourself caught and charged in court and avail yourself of the free legal assistance of the PAO, Public Attorney's Office (I think). This way, if you're right then, MARINA will be put in its proper place.
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Legalese...

Postby Sqworks » Thu Jun 04, 2009 5:36 pm

Hi Guys,

I am already lost in the legalese .

I got some suggestion, HAVE FRIENDS, that is the way it works a round here. At least as I know of.

No friends, and even the mice can eat you up.

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Postby Skywoolf » Thu Jun 04, 2009 6:07 pm

lncc63 wrote:Nice post skywolf. I think you could be on to something but I'm no lawyer. Why all the effort?


Its no effort really. I planned to set up a boat building and repair business for local kids to learn and take over the business but have now decided its not worth all the hassle. Sorry for the kids but I am sick of this sort of thing so I will not even fight it. I posted here for the benefit of those who need to know. According to MARINA all the foreigners building little boats in the garage are doing it illegally and they can't own a boat anyway!

Sqworks,
Yep I know and I do know some of the right people but like I said I am so sick of arrogant officials inventing rules and laws that are not legal that I won't fight it. I just give up like the locals do.
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Postby Sqworks » Thu Jun 04, 2009 6:36 pm

I am so sick of arrogant officials inventing rules and laws


Hi Skywoolf,

EXACTLY ... mice in power...

I myself have learned to live with that.

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Postby davaodan » Thu Jun 04, 2009 6:42 pm

Hi Frank,

Thank you for doing this research on MARINA and boat registration requirements here in the Philippines. I hope it has put your mind to rest, as it has mine. As for me and my newest boat, I will not attempt to register it through any government entity other than the barangay, perhaps. I may talk to the Kanaan Kapitan and see what he has to say.

Much appreciated,

Dan in Davao
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Postby Lorenzo » Thu Jun 04, 2009 6:43 pm

MEMORANDUM CIRCULAR NO. 95

Section 1.1.4 “Boatbuilding” shall mean the design, construction, launching and outfitting of watercrafts with sizes ranging from fifteen(15) gross tons and below.


Most of us belong here, but I think this memo is directed to an enterprising individual. :lol: It is irrelevant to get a business name, mayor`s permit, and BIR registration, for a boatbuilder`s license, only for a couple of homebuilt boats that is for personal and recreational use only.

... only to realize that engineless sailboats under 3 tons is exempted from registration.

P.D. 474 Section 12. Specific Powers and Functions of the Administrator. In addition to his general powers and functions, the Administrator shall;

a. Issue Certificate of Philippine Registry for all vessels being used in Philippine waters, including fishing vessels covered by Presidential Decree No. 43 except transient civilian vessels of foreign registry, vessels owned and/or operated by the Armed Forces of the Philippines or by foreign governments for military purposes, and bancas, sailboats and other watercraft which are not motorized, of less than three gross tons;
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Postby Lorenzo » Thu Jun 04, 2009 7:34 pm

skywolf wrote:According to MARINA all the foreigners building little boats in the garage are doing it illegally and they can't own a boat anyway!


Don`t take that statement seriously Frank, those new laws on "little boats" is a flop. They are having a hard time implementing that. Take that backyard boatbuilding as equivalent to a common tiny "sari-sari" store across the street.

I said I am so sick of arrogant officials inventing rules and laws that are not legal that I won't fight it. I just give up like the locals do.


I`m a type of a person that fights back (been doing this in the past against arrogant building officials and inspectors). I might insult them someday to register my homebuilt bamboo raft with a cement mixer motor.


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Postby Sqworks » Thu Jun 04, 2009 8:15 pm

Hi Lorenzo,

I salute you !

Every person who FIGHTS oppression I salute and honor.
When the government gets too big, we fight by attrition !
If it need some downsizing, Grind it down to needed size !

Maybe a Cha cha got some sense, LAWS needs an overhaul .
Government must be de-powered, more autonomy for everyone.

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Postby Skywoolf » Thu Jun 04, 2009 10:00 pm

I am very happy that someone will fight but I spent 6 years working full time fighting exactly this sort of thing. We even had court rulings and even the supreme court ruling in our favor but those concerned simply ignored the courts and continued with their illegal rules. Those I was fighting for did very little to support us and some stabbed me in the back.

That's why I have no further interest in fighting but I will definitely support anyone who does want to fight.
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Postby kebang » Sun Dec 12, 2010 3:08 pm

. According to MARINA all the foreigners building little boats in the garage are doing it illegally and they can't own a boat anyway!



I know this thread is old, but there appears to be useful info here. Is it true foreigners cannot own a boat?
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